Episode 8
Leading Differently Together | "Prophets" With Cath Livesey
Find us at https://journeywithcare.ca/
Description
In this insightful conversation we welcome Cath Livesey to explore the vital role of prophets within the Church's APEST model. Cath delves deep into the prophetic identity and voice, encouraging listeners to engage in contemplation and stillness to foster their connection with God.
Through a narrative woven with personal experiences and practical advice, we discuss the essentials of effective communication for prophets, the synergies between apostolic and prophetic ministries, and the overarching necessity of discernment to ensure prophecy aligns with God's character.
This conversation serves as a compelling guide for anyone looking to deepen their understanding of prophecy and its place in contemporary faith practice.
Time Stamps
[06:09] Book discusses diverse prophetic traditions, urging unity.
[09:49] Demystifying prophecy: hearing God and sharing his words.
[13:06] Prophets are wired for worship and warfare.
[15:07] Prophets empower church by channeling their gifts.
[17:22] Maturing prophetic gifting involves love and alignment.
[23:30] Discern scripture, listen to community for guidance.
[27:23] Reclaiming church's prophetic voice for global hope.
[29:14] Commit to 5 minutes daily stillness with God.
Guest Links
Accessible Prophecy Canada: https://accessibleprophecy.com/canada/
Holy Disruption Book: https://a.co/d/2au8V3L
Podcast: https://accessibleprophecy.com/the-prophecy-project-podcast/
Linkdin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cath-livesey-273577267/
Other Links
Join the Sojourner's Discussion Group: https://www.careimpact.ca/group/journey-with-care-podcast/discussion
CareImpact: careimpact.ca
About the CarePortal: careimpact.ca/careportal
DONATE! Help connect and equip more churches across Canada to effectively journey well in community with children and families: careimpact.ca/donate
Email: podcast@careimpact.ca
Editing and production by Johan Heinrichs: arkpodcasts.ca
Transcript
As prophets, we we maintain that soft
Speaker:heart at the center of church, really grounded in community rather than
Speaker:being that critical voice on the edge of church. We wanna be fully grounded
Speaker:in community, then we have so much to offer the church.
Speaker:What does loving your neighbor actually look like?
Speaker:This is Journey with Cath, where curious Canadians get inspired
Speaker:to love others well through real life stories and honest
Speaker:conversations.
Speaker:Hey, Curious Sojourner. We're continuing in our series, Leading
Speaker:Differently Together. I'm so glad you're on this journey with me as we
Speaker:meet up with some fascinating people who are living in their sweet spots.
Speaker:In Ephesians 41112, it says, God gives some to
Speaker:be apostles, prophets, evangelists, shepherds, and teachers
Speaker:to equip the saints for the work of the ministry for building up the
Speaker:body of Christ. And today, we're gonna get curious about the
Speaker:prophetic. What do you think of when you hear that word? Across
Speaker:denominations and diverse experiences, prophecy can take a
Speaker:lot of heat and a lot of fanfare. But what makes
Speaker:something actually prophetic and what may seem
Speaker:something, well, pathetic? Stick around. I think you're gonna love
Speaker:today's episode as we explore what the Bible has to say about it
Speaker:and what it means for us here in Canada. I'm your host, Wendy
Speaker:Park, joined by producer Johan Hinrichs. And in studio today, we have
Speaker:a special guest all the way from the UK, Cath Livesey,
Speaker:founder of Accessible Prophecy and author of Holy
Speaker:Disruption, My Sheep Have Ears, and the prophecy course.
Speaker:Cath, welcome to the podcast. Thank you. It's great to be
Speaker:here. Cath, you work with churches around the world and
Speaker:including Canada and have a passion for nurturing a
Speaker:healthy prophetic culture. And I've actually sat in one of your workshops and
Speaker:was blown away by how down to Cath and truly accessible
Speaker:you made the topic of prophecy. Can you take me on a a
Speaker:brief tour of your personal story? How did you get
Speaker:to understanding prophecy and the prophetic in
Speaker:such a personal accessible way. Like, you can't make those things
Speaker:up. Sure. Well, I guess for me, it has been a
Speaker:long, slow journey. I became a Christian
Speaker:many, many years ago. And in those 1st years,
Speaker:it was all about the bible and, you know, I was discipled
Speaker:well. But it was only when I turned up at university and
Speaker:people started to talk about the holy spirit and the gifts of the
Speaker:spirit that I really learned anything
Speaker:about prophecy. And I guess since then, I was just
Speaker:intrigued. I was fascinated with this idea that, yeah,
Speaker:almighty god, creator of the heavens and Cath, might actually wanna
Speaker:talk to me, not just through the eternal words of the
Speaker:bible, but God might wanna talk to me in the here and
Speaker:now about what's going on for me here and now. And I think
Speaker:alongside that, I've always known, I've always had
Speaker:this deep, deep intuitive knowledge that God is so
Speaker:much better and so much closer than we can
Speaker:think or imagine. I've always been absolutely
Speaker:intrigued by God and just a passion to
Speaker:to get closer and closer and closer. So I think
Speaker:these sorts of things have been just key markers for
Speaker:me, things that have prompted me to dig deeper.
Speaker:In in my early days of exploring the prophetic, to be honest, there weren't
Speaker:that many helpful books out there. You had to
Speaker:search quite hard to find trustworthy guides.
Speaker:And I think that's why I've just got such a
Speaker:passion for helping every single Christian learn how
Speaker:to hear God's voice because way back when I was starting off,
Speaker:there weren't that many faithful guides around. Yeah. I
Speaker:was curious about that because when I was sitting in your course, and I've also
Speaker:read your book, the holy disruption, which is excellent, by the way, and we're
Speaker:gonna include that link in the show notes. I I think people here
Speaker:will definitely wanna read through that. But I
Speaker:was curious because when I was sitting there, it wasn't information that
Speaker:seemed apparently from a particular denomination. It
Speaker:felt like for the whole church. And and that got me
Speaker:curious about your upbringing and how you came to understand
Speaker:your own prophetic voice, and was that nurtured as a young
Speaker:child? But you said you you really had to seek
Speaker:answers for that truth? Yeah. I I guess
Speaker:I've got quite an ecumenical approach. I was brought
Speaker:up in the Anglican church in the the the Church of England.
Speaker:As a student, I I went to a Baptist church.
Speaker:Then when we got married, we spent a long time in what you could
Speaker:Cath, like, a free church or a house church. So Mhmm. I yeah. I
Speaker:have a real passion for the global body of Christ.
Speaker:And I think sometimes the prophetic has
Speaker:been seen to be something just for the charismatic.
Speaker:But I passionately believe that that this ministry,
Speaker:this authentic prophetic lifestyle, it's for every
Speaker:expression, every denomination, every stream. And, yeah,
Speaker:in in my experience here in Canada too, as I I have had
Speaker:some meaningful conversations with Catholic as well as
Speaker:charismatic and everything in between, conservative,
Speaker:there seems to be a resonance. If we understood
Speaker:what actually and we're gonna dive into what we're talking about by the
Speaker:biblical understanding of prophecy and the prophetic. I
Speaker:seem to hear those voices from within those denominations,
Speaker:god speaking and and listening to God's voice. And in
Speaker:your book, you also talk about the contemplative
Speaker:and also the charismatic, and both can be true. But
Speaker:sometimes we may pigeonhole it in 1 or the other, and we may misunderstand
Speaker:the full depth of how God really connects
Speaker:with with his church. Yeah. And I think one of the key things I
Speaker:wanted to do in the book was to take
Speaker:that 30,000 foot perspective on the prophetic
Speaker:and, you know, to help everybody regardless of their of their denominational
Speaker:background see the bigger picture. And, yeah,
Speaker:absolutely, there's riches and depths in the charismatic
Speaker:tradition, but there's also, you know, incredible wisdom
Speaker:in the contemplative tradition. And then you have what you could call
Speaker:more of a social justice expression of the prophetic,
Speaker:which is really important for for some churches.
Speaker:And what I want every church to do is to learn from all these
Speaker:different approaches and to get a holistic,
Speaker:big picture understanding of the prophetic and and what it means
Speaker:to faithfully follow the voice of God, both on
Speaker:a church wide perspective, but as individual Christians.
Speaker:So, you know, in terms of the fivefold,
Speaker:whether you're apostle, prophet, evangelist, shepherd, or teacher,
Speaker:we can all learn what you could call prophetic intelligence. You
Speaker:can we can all learn just as a normal everyday
Speaker:Christian how to listen for the voice of God,
Speaker:how to pay attention to God's voice, how to
Speaker:discern the particular ways that the Holy Spirit gets our
Speaker:attention and and talks to us. And this is for
Speaker:every single follower of Jesus. Are you describing
Speaker:the mission of accessible prophecy in what you just said there? Is
Speaker:that your goal and intent? Yeah. Definitely. We have a
Speaker:twofold vision. So first of all, it is to help every Christian
Speaker:learn how to hear God's voice, to live in the reality of John
Speaker:chapter 10 where Jesus says, 4 times, my sheep
Speaker:hear my voice, and we're the sheep, and and Jesus is speaking,
Speaker:Jesus is still speaking. So that's the first part of our vision. The second
Speaker:part of our vision is to help every single
Speaker:church develop a healthy prophetic culture.
Speaker:So, yeah, it's the individual, but it's also the church.
Speaker:And you do have a small presence here in Canada as well on the East
Speaker:Coast that are meeting. I think it's prophetic huddles. Is that what we call
Speaker:it? Yeah. Definitely. So we have a
Speaker:team, the Accessible Prophecy Canada team. They're
Speaker:currently based in Nova Scotia, but slowly
Speaker:growing, doing online,
Speaker:opportunities like webinars, doing some in person
Speaker:events. But the main offering are what we call these
Speaker:online coaching huddles, prophetic coaching huddles, which are
Speaker:small cohorts of 3 or 4 or 5 people with one of our
Speaker:trained coaches who go on this deep dive into,
Speaker:what it looks like to develop that authentic, mature, holistic,
Speaker:prophetic lifestyle. So do check out Accessible Prophecy
Speaker:Canada. Yeah. And we'll include the, link in
Speaker:the show notes, and I just love that there's a way for it to
Speaker:be nurtured because sometimes when we don't have that language within
Speaker:their church or maybe it's it's a foreign concept for us to find other
Speaker:people more mature in the faith, in those
Speaker:giftings to guide us along, I think, is is such a beautiful thing of the
Speaker:body of Christ. We're no longer bound by geography anymore,
Speaker:and, we can connect, the the body of Christ
Speaker:over online or and in person. I'd like to dive into
Speaker:what we're meaning by the word prophecy and the prophetic. Can
Speaker:you demystify that for me And and for our listeners, what do
Speaker:we mean by prophecy? Absolutely.
Speaker:And I think this demystification
Speaker:yeah, there's potentially a lot of misconceptions and misunderstandings
Speaker:around the prophetic. Some people just wanna run away
Speaker:from it, have nothing to do with with this ministry. So
Speaker:I'm all for simple, straightforward definitions.
Speaker:So prophecy, very simply, is hearing God
Speaker:speaking and repeating what he says. And particularly
Speaker:when we look at the new testament, we see in
Speaker:Paul's writings this thing called the gift of prophecy.
Speaker:And what we notice is it's not, an exclusive
Speaker:gift just for the very anointed ones or for leaders.
Speaker:But, you know, Paul invites all of us to
Speaker:eagerly pursue spiritual gifts, especially
Speaker:prophecy. And he goes on to talk about how the gift of prophecy
Speaker:is for people's strengthening encouragement and comfort.
Speaker:So it sounds like a fantastic gift that each and
Speaker:every one of us wanna be pursuing. I I like to talk
Speaker:about how, you know, we all have a spiritual toolkit.
Speaker:And no matter what our main calling or gifting is, we all have this
Speaker:spiritual toolkit. And prophecy, the gift of prophecy, is a fantastic
Speaker:tool to have in your toolkit that you can pull out at any
Speaker:time to strengthen and encourage and comfort people.
Speaker:So so that's a simple definition of prophecy. When it then
Speaker:comes to the word prophet because, goodness me, that's a word that we
Speaker:need to demystify. And, of course, there's an
Speaker:old testament understanding of the word, but
Speaker:we also find prophets in the new testament.
Speaker:And Ephesians 411 tells us that Christ has given
Speaker:prophets to his church. So it's not just an old testament
Speaker:role. It's something for the new covenant church of God.
Speaker:And I really think we need to grasp a new testament
Speaker:perspective. Yeah. The old testament's helpful, but we can end up with some
Speaker:stereotypes. So let's fix our attention on a new
Speaker:testament perspective and let's fix our attention on how
Speaker:Jesus himself walked in that prophetic role because
Speaker:Jesus is our best role model. He's our ultimate prophet. The
Speaker:way I, again, simply define a prophet is
Speaker:it's somebody with a particular calling and
Speaker:wiring to stay attuned to
Speaker:God's hearts and to help keep the church
Speaker:aligned with God's purposes. And I would
Speaker:also say that prophets, they're wired for
Speaker:both worship and warfare. And what I mean by that
Speaker:is, first of all, you know, prophets have such a heart
Speaker:for worship that their passion is the heart of God. They want to help
Speaker:everybody draw closer to God. They wanna help
Speaker:curate and cultivate a worshipful culture
Speaker:in the church. And they're not looking for just status quo
Speaker:either. Right? Oh, no. Goodness. Like your book, like, they're disruptors
Speaker:in a holy sense, drawing us back to the father's heart Yeah.
Speaker:Which is which is beautiful. Absolutely. So there's
Speaker:that real call and drive for
Speaker:worship and alongside that, you know, challenging any idolatry.
Speaker:But then prophets are wired for warfare.
Speaker:And what I mean by that, yeah, part of it is spiritual warfare
Speaker:because prophets are very kind of spiritually sensitive.
Speaker:Prophets often are the first to take note of
Speaker:any any signs of spiritual unhealth in
Speaker:the body. You know, it's a question we're always asking as prophets, are we
Speaker:healthy or are we unhealthy? So there's Cath of like
Speaker:spiritual warfare, intercession side of things, but there's also the broader
Speaker:perspective of looking out on the world
Speaker:through God's eyes. And where
Speaker:does the church need to have that
Speaker:voice? You know, what strongholds need pulling down? What
Speaker:areas of injustice need challenging? That's a
Speaker:part of the prophet's perspective on warfare. So, yeah,
Speaker:worship and warfare. So they're kind of like a
Speaker:chiropractor would bring into alignment the skeleton of the body when there's some
Speaker:there's a dissonance or a wheel alignment. You're gonna go off to the side of
Speaker:the road if you keep going like this, and they they keep tuning us back
Speaker:into alignment. And, they're keenly aware of
Speaker:those things that are brought to our attention. Absolutely.
Speaker:Absolutely. How is a prophetic voice
Speaker:edifying? And when we look at, Ephesians 41112,
Speaker:it's for building up, for edification of the body. In
Speaker:what ways are you seeing churches embrace not just
Speaker:solely the prophetic now we're gonna just focus on prophecy. We're we're looking at the
Speaker:5 fold. How have you seen the prophetic
Speaker:really edify and build up a body of Christ that maybe with other
Speaker:giftings that are sitting around that table or sitting in in a
Speaker:congregation, how are you seeing it at its best in its health
Speaker:edifying the body of Christ? Yeah. I I think the 5
Speaker:fold perspective, the APES perspective is absolutely key. We never want the
Speaker:And we're gonna get the healthiest church when all 5
Speaker:are working really, really well together. And as I work with
Speaker:churches around the world, I am very much helping
Speaker:them cultivate that servant hearted attitude when it comes to
Speaker:the prophetic. So it's not about me and my gifts.
Speaker:It's, well, how do we channel these
Speaker:particular gifts to help build up everybody? There's a
Speaker:brilliant verse in Acts where Luke
Speaker:describes 2 prophets in the early church, Judas and Silas,
Speaker:and it's just a little sentence. And and Luke says that
Speaker:Judas and Silas, who themselves were prophets, said much to
Speaker:encourage and strengthen the believers. And that's
Speaker:a little perspective on the the
Speaker:great strength and health that prophets were bringing to the
Speaker:early church. And I think when we help prophets
Speaker:get this broader perspective on who they're called to be,
Speaker:on what they bring to the church. So, yeah, part of it is about bringing
Speaker:the word of God, but it's about equipping
Speaker:everybody in the church to hear God. You know, I would say, in in some
Speaker:ways, that's the number one role of the prophet, to help every single
Speaker:person learn how to hear God's voice in the same way that the role of
Speaker:an evangelist, yes, is to go out and win win souls for Jesus, but
Speaker:it's the role of the evangelist in the church is to help us all
Speaker:learn how to be bold in sharing our faith. So, yeah,
Speaker:equipping the body, listening on behalf of the
Speaker:body, being prepared to challenge the status quo.
Speaker:And when it's done in a humble, gentle,
Speaker:accountable way, you know, we we need to ensure that there's there's good
Speaker:accountability, there's good channels of communication,
Speaker:that as prophets, we we maintain that
Speaker:soft heart at the center of church, really grounded in community
Speaker:rather than being that critical voice on the edge of church, we wanna be fully
Speaker:grounded in community, then we have so much
Speaker:to to offer the church. And I guess in in health, at
Speaker:in maturation of the prophetic gifting, one
Speaker:would need to develop that
Speaker:love for the church and to say things in love, to direct
Speaker:people in love, even in in some some of the
Speaker:harsher things that would bring alignment, that would be
Speaker:disruptive in the sense of, like, calling people back into worship,
Speaker:calling people back into even social gaps in
Speaker:the community. They see things. They hear things. They have ear to the ground, not
Speaker:only to God, but I also see it active in ear to
Speaker:the community. And what are we hearing within the community? Where is
Speaker:God wanting the church to be in alignment with God? I'm just
Speaker:wondering, how do you see that play out in the
Speaker:to full maturation? I guess we're always maturing, but what is that
Speaker:like to to see that mature? Yeah. I
Speaker:mean, just a few things I'd wanna share there.
Speaker:So I always encourage profits I'm working with to
Speaker:work really hard on their communication skills. And what I'll often say
Speaker:is you can have the most remarkable, you
Speaker:know, mind blowing vision or word from the Lord. But if you
Speaker:can't communicate it in a way that people will listen,
Speaker:pretty much wasted. So for some
Speaker:prophets, it's about learning succinct, effective
Speaker:communication. And again, you know, keeping their hearts
Speaker:soft, learning how to speak with gentleness,
Speaker:learning how to speak really, really effectively. So, you know, the whole communication
Speaker:piece can be actually the the one thing that
Speaker:truly, truly makes the difference. I'll often
Speaker:say to prophets, ask God who your apostle
Speaker:is in this season. And I've been so
Speaker:blessed over the years as I have, you know, developed my own
Speaker:prophetic ministry that God's always provided me with an apostle.
Speaker:You know, the the prophetic and the apostolic, they really need
Speaker:each other. They really, really need each other. And as prophets,
Speaker:we have so much to learn from the apostolic because what
Speaker:and turning it into something real and lived and
Speaker:applicable. So learning the way of the
Speaker:apostle, learning really good application
Speaker:from the apostle can do so much to mature,
Speaker:prophetic ministry. But that's true of the whole fivefold. So, you know,
Speaker:as prophets, we need to be learning from the evangelists, the shepherds, and teachers as
Speaker:well. Yeah. I think that is really valuable to to put into
Speaker:perspective. And I I think some of the pushback that
Speaker:I've observed within church's
Speaker:experience of the prophetic, some of the pushback might be
Speaker:this wariness towards what could be considered false
Speaker:prophecy or these whimsical ideas that are
Speaker:maybe even a way of manipulation and sometimes has been a way
Speaker:of manipulation of how God told me to say this to the church and
Speaker:thus saith the lord. And we will see extremes in any of this
Speaker:fight. We have to have discernment. Correct? But how do we
Speaker:discern what is of God and what is not? When
Speaker:somebody comes, regardless may may not even know their
Speaker:maturity in the Lord, but how do we discern the
Speaker:prophetic voice? Yeah. Absolutely. I and I think
Speaker:that the gift of discernment is an absolutely
Speaker:vital gift for the church, particularly in the days that we're all
Speaker:living through. So I encourage people
Speaker:that I'm mentoring and discipling to be asking God for the
Speaker:gift of discernment every day. That's something I try and do. The
Speaker:bible is very clear. The new testaments are very clear when it comes to
Speaker:prophecy that all prophecy needs to be weighed and
Speaker:tested and discerned. And the new testament says that repeatedly.
Speaker:So how do we discern? And I think first of
Speaker:all, we we discern from the character and nature
Speaker:of God. We, of course, discern from the
Speaker:bible. Something that I'll often say to people is listen for the
Speaker:voice that is kind. Listen for the voice that is kind, that is
Speaker:full of life and light and that reflects Jesus?
Speaker:And does this sound like Jesus? There are a lot
Speaker:of voices out there. And today, you know,
Speaker:through YouTube and and and every other platform,
Speaker:there are a 1,000 and one prophetic voices we could listen
Speaker:to. But which one reflects the voice of Jesus? Which one
Speaker:sounds like Jesus? And I think the more we are
Speaker:walking with God, the more we are circling ourselves in the
Speaker:bible, in the written word, the easier it is to
Speaker:discern. Yeah. The more we're we're walking with the Holy Spirit and asking for the
Speaker:Holy Spirit's help and discernment, the easier it becomes.
Speaker:I think there's good practice when it comes to the
Speaker:prophetic. And if, you know, a stranger just
Speaker:rocks up with this completely out of nowhere prophetic
Speaker:word, then there are gonna be a lot of hoops
Speaker:that, you know, that word is gonna have to jump through before we would say
Speaker:this is the voice of God. You know, we we have to
Speaker:equip everybody in our churches to weigh and test really, really
Speaker:well. Just because you hear some prophet
Speaker:on YouTube say this or that or the other does not mean
Speaker:that you are hearing a true revelation, a true word of
Speaker:prophecy that's come that has come from God's heart. There are questions we can ask
Speaker:in terms of, well, who's this person accountable to? Is this
Speaker:person part of a a a 5 fold
Speaker:team? You know, there are lots of questions that we can ask as we look
Speaker:for good practice, good wise practice in
Speaker:the prophetic. And I think that's a beautiful example of why we wanna weigh
Speaker:in to the 5 fold because there might be a pastoral gift, a teaching gift
Speaker:that would discern and bring scripture to the pastoral gift, a teaching gift that would
Speaker:discern and bring scripture to light or bring a
Speaker:nurture awareness to their congregation if it is kind, if it
Speaker:is edifying, it is it is true of god. I think in
Speaker:my understanding and growth in the prophetic,
Speaker:I also have to realize I cannot always
Speaker:hear to the minutest detail what god is exactly saying.
Speaker:He's not downloading a recipe. Sometimes he does. He's not
Speaker:giving me a formula of exactly what to do, but we need the apostolic
Speaker:to to go out and try anyway, to to venture out and
Speaker:to to have a a different sense
Speaker:of how to move forward with that word. I'm curious,
Speaker:though, as we've developed Care Impact and
Speaker:been formed by not only what God has spoken to us
Speaker:in dreams and vision and and what we're hearing from the church and the
Speaker:needs that need to fill in the gap, which is a very prophetic
Speaker:role to see between social services and the church, and
Speaker:how do we bring the church into the community as Jesus has
Speaker:called us to be good neighbors. And our whole motto is making
Speaker:helping strangers become good neighbors. One of the things that
Speaker:I've been hearing that has shaped some of what I've understood, even
Speaker:Jesus in scripture, is listening to those
Speaker:that I don't always listen to right in the community they've actually
Speaker:been a prophetic voice in my life as I've welcomed. Do you
Speaker:know that the verse where it says to welcome, be hospitable to
Speaker:strangers for sometimes unknowingly you are
Speaker:hosting angels. Also, the word is messengers. And
Speaker:maybe not angels with the the fluttery wings and halo sense, but
Speaker:bringing in strangers, they've actually had words for me
Speaker:and helped me understand scripture and brought me into alignment.
Speaker:Is that a thing? Because I I feel like sometimes we can keep
Speaker:the prophetic right in the walls of the institution of the
Speaker:church and have this Kumbaya mountaintop experience,
Speaker:but I feel often in our work that there's a dissonance
Speaker:with what people are saying, what God is saying through people and and through
Speaker:circumstances and calling the church to be relevant. Can you
Speaker:speak to any of that? Does it even make sense? Sure.
Speaker:I think that as each of us
Speaker:pursues a tuned in lifestyle,
Speaker:a day by day walk with Jesus, where we
Speaker:are creating enough pause to pay attention to
Speaker:God throughout the day, recognizing that, you know, we'll
Speaker:hear God in different ways. But we are slowing down. We're
Speaker:paying attention. We are seeking to look
Speaker:at the world around us, to look at the community, the neighborhood around us through
Speaker:the eyes of Jesus. We are whenever we leave the church
Speaker:building, whenever we leave our front door, we are going out with the
Speaker:Holy Spirit to keep in step with the spirit, then God can speak in
Speaker:all sorts of ways, very much through
Speaker:unexpected channels. I guess he did it through donkeys. Right?
Speaker:Absolutely. Absolutely. And again, I think this is a mistake that
Speaker:we've made. We've put a straight jacket on the prophetic.
Speaker:We've thought, well, it's gonna look like this. But, actually, you know,
Speaker:we can't put God in a box. We cannot constrain the Holy Spirit.
Speaker:And that's part of the this beautiful journey we all go
Speaker:on as we really pay attention to the different ways
Speaker:that God talks to us. You know, for some people, God is
Speaker:very much talking through through nature. For some of us,
Speaker:it'll be just the voices we hear out and about in in our
Speaker:community, but let's pay attention. Let's walk slowly
Speaker:enough so that we can discern what god is
Speaker:saying through some surprising avenues.
Speaker:Cath, I'd love to read just an excerpt from your book.
Speaker:Hopefully, people can can get it on Amazon or wherever they buy their
Speaker:books to read it for themselves, but you you wrap up
Speaker:the prophetic in a really beautiful way on page
Speaker:Wendi. The church of Jesus Christ needs to reclaim
Speaker:its prophetic identity and rediscover its prophetic voice, a
Speaker:voice that speaks hope to the hopeless, that calls for transformation
Speaker:across spheres of human experience and that is more than
Speaker:capable of standing up to tyranny and oppression. A
Speaker:voice that originates in the heart of our utterly free, powerful,
Speaker:and compassionate God. The father who chooses to reach
Speaker:out to humanity crafted in his image and make himself
Speaker:known. A voice that is carried on by the winds of the
Speaker:spirit to every corner of the globe, ready to be perceived
Speaker:by all who take time to listen. This earth shattering
Speaker:paradigm shifting yet tender voice cannot be appropriated
Speaker:for human agendas or ideologies. The prophets
Speaker:of old were overwhelmed by it as they allowed the
Speaker:word of Yahweh to be wholly incarnated in their lives.
Speaker:Prophets today can learn to thrive in the profound depths of this
Speaker:voice as they teach the church to discern and carry it.
Speaker:The voice to be rediscovered is the voice of love.
Speaker:The prophetic is the love language of God of relationship
Speaker:and revelation. I think that's just profound. It it sort of
Speaker:sums up some of what we've been talking about, but there is so much
Speaker:more to dive into. Cath, as we conclude
Speaker:this conversation, are there any practical next steps that you
Speaker:might be able to offer me and and my listeners here
Speaker:in Canada to to grow in the prophetic?
Speaker:Sure. Well, a really, really simple
Speaker:next step that any of us can do is
Speaker:perhaps to commit, say, over the next 4 or 5
Speaker:days, just to find 5 minutes
Speaker:in your day. That's all you need to find, 4 or 5 minutes.
Speaker:And go somewhere or find somewhere
Speaker:where you're not gonna get distracted, so turn off your phone,
Speaker:maybe go for a walk, and just
Speaker:practice being still in God's
Speaker:presence. And for some of us, you know, our minds are going at a 100
Speaker:miles an hour. It it's it's really challenging to do that.
Speaker:But just practice being still in God's presence.
Speaker:And then maybe choose one of your favorite
Speaker:bible verses and just meditate on it
Speaker:and say to God, father, what do you wanna say to me today
Speaker:through this verse? And just give yourself a few minutes
Speaker:just to do the pause, to do the stillness, to do the
Speaker:meditation, and welcome whatever revelation God might wanna
Speaker:bring. Maybe God will remind you of another bible verse. Maybe a
Speaker:little simple picture will pop into your head. Maybe you'll
Speaker:discern some words from the father. But it's
Speaker:just creating that moment of pause in your busy day
Speaker:to step back, enjoy God's presence, and be
Speaker:open to however he might want to talk to you. And that's something that we
Speaker:can all do. Well, that's something I'm gonna try to do this
Speaker:next week. And on that note, I wanna encourage people, if
Speaker:you're wanting help to pray along with these things and and be
Speaker:challenged, join our journey with prayer. We we
Speaker:offer that every Monday. It's a reflective, contemplative
Speaker:prayer that we put out there from from the Friday's episode.
Speaker:We have that every Monday if you would like to to journey in
Speaker:prayer with us to follow along on Wendi. But thank you, Cath, for
Speaker:taking time for this beautiful conversation, this needed
Speaker:conversation, and I wanna encourage our listeners to stay
Speaker:tuned as we uncover all the stories from the different
Speaker:fivefold giftings. Thank you so much, Cath. Thank
Speaker:you. Thank you. It's been great.
Speaker:Thank you for joining another conversation on Journey with Cath, where
Speaker:we inspire curious Canadians on their path of faith and
Speaker:living life with purpose in community. Journey with Care is an
Speaker:initiative of Care Impact, a Canadian charity dedicated to
Speaker:connecting and equipping the whole church to journey well in community.
Speaker:You can visit their website at careimpact.ca or visit journeywithcare.
Speaker:Ca to get more information on weekly episodes, Journey with Prayer,
Speaker:and details about our upcoming events and meet ups. You can also
Speaker:leave us a message, share your thoughts, and connect with like minded
Speaker:individuals who are on their own journeys of faith and purpose.
Speaker:Thank you for sharing this podcast and helping these stories reach the
Speaker:community. Together, we can explore ways to journey in a good way.
Speaker:And always remember to stay curious.
