The Ripple Effect: Why Small Acts of Kindness Matter with Zach Manntai
Partner with work of CareImpact and Journey With Care!
Description
Have you ever paused to think about the profound impact of small acts of kindness?
Hosts Wendy and Johan Heinrichs explore this very theme with guest Zach Manntai. They delve into why seemingly insignificant gestures can have substantial ripple effects over time. Johan reflects on how the early church was known for their love and bottom-up approach, influencing culture profoundly. Wendy shares a personal story of receiving a dream guitar, emphasizing how generosity transcends the initial act. Zach brings insightful perspectives as he ties together compassion fatigue, sustainable care, and the intersection of faith with public health and justice. Together, they discuss the often-overlooked significance of forming a habit of kindness, the challenges of our transactional society, and the transformative power of presence.
Time Stamps
[05:33] Small Acts, Big Impact
[07:38] Everyday Kindness Matters
[11:46] Cultivating Resilient Communities
[13:29] "Kindness vs. Instant Gratification"
[19:29] Embracing Imperfection and Smallness
[23:20] "Transformative Love of Early Christians"
[25:42] Purposeful Kindness Aligned with Calling
[30:31] "Empowering Youth for the Future"
[31:48] Youth Empowerment for Community Change
[36:02] "Reevaluating Health Care Priorities"
[39:39] Care LIngo
Guest Links
For The City: https://www.forthecty.com/
Other Links
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Transcript
It's so funny when you think about the the concepts around the early
Speaker:church of how they were known by their love, how they were
Speaker:known by the way that they postured themselves from
Speaker:this bottom up approach that the kingdom of God was
Speaker:just seen throughout the early church because
Speaker:of the way that they lived with all parts of their lives.
Speaker:You knew that they were Christians and you wanted to be with them. You
Speaker:knew what it was like to be loved by them, and
Speaker:that posture that they provided as an example to the
Speaker:world changed culture.
Speaker:What if kindness isn't a moment, but a rhythm? What
Speaker:if changing the world doesn't look like a grand gesture, but like showing
Speaker:up again and again? This is
Speaker:Journey with Care, a podcast by Care Care Impact where curious
Speaker:Canadians find inspiration to love others well through real life
Speaker:stories and honest conversations.
Speaker:A few years ago for my fortieth birthday, my wife organized a Go
Speaker:GoFundMe so that I can finally get my dream acoustic
Speaker:guitar. It wasn't cheap, not something we could have
Speaker:justified on our own, but friends and family showed up.
Speaker:People I've journeyed with, done life with, sat across the table
Speaker:with, they all chipped in. And on my birthday, I walked
Speaker:into a guitar shop, and I picked it up and brought it home.
Speaker:I'm still in awe of the generosity and love that put that guitar into my
Speaker:hands. It wasn't just about getting a nice instrument. It was about what
Speaker:it represented. It was their way of saying, we believe in
Speaker:you. We believe in what God is doing through you. And to this
Speaker:day, I think of those friends and family every time I pick it up.
Speaker:What's even more beautiful is that the gift didn't stop with me.
Speaker:I've been able to lead worship with that guitar, not just in my home church,
Speaker:but in other communities too. It's a way of sharing back what was
Speaker:given. And the truth is, I couldn't have measured the ripple
Speaker:effect of that gift in that moment. But over time, I've seen
Speaker:how small acts of kindness, when rooted in love, keep
Speaker:moving outward. That's what Zach reminds us of in this episode.
Speaker:That kindness isn't always loud or measurable. Sometimes it's just
Speaker:presence. Sometimes it's showing up with what's in your hand and
Speaker:trusting that God will multiply it. Our guest today is Zach
Speaker:Mantai, someone who's not only a friend of the podcast, but someone who's
Speaker:helped us kick off this Cost of Indifference series with his thoughtful,
Speaker:honest reflections on compassion, fatigue, and sustainable care.
Speaker:Zach is a community builder, a systems thinker, and a
Speaker:passionate advocate for youth and mental health. He works at the
Speaker:intersection of faith, public health, and justice. And he doesn't
Speaker:just talk about kindness, he lives it in the everyday.
Speaker:What I love about Zach is that he brings both conviction and humility
Speaker:into every conversation. He helps us zoom out to see the bigger
Speaker:picture, but never loses sight of the individual. In today's episode,
Speaker:we pick up where we left off, exploring the quiet power of
Speaker:small acts of kindness and how over time, they
Speaker:ripple into real change. So, Wendy, let's get this
Speaker:conversation going. I would love to. So good to have you back here,
Speaker:Zach, in studio with us to talk about this next episode. But before
Speaker:we get started, I wanna ask you, if kindness were a mascot,
Speaker:like a character or an animal or something that you can imagine, what would
Speaker:it be and why? What a strange question,
Speaker:Wendy. And, yes, it's wonderful to be back. But I can say I had
Speaker:never thought about kindness as a mascot or a character in
Speaker:in any way. And so I decided to come up with a strange
Speaker:one. So follow this if best you can. The best answer I could
Speaker:come up with was a b. Now one of
Speaker:the things about kindness in our conversation today that I think is interesting
Speaker:is that bees are often thought about in their
Speaker:busyness and their work ethic. But think about this. Bees
Speaker:perform small tasks unnoticed yet have enormous impact through
Speaker:pollination. They're essential for ecosystems, and they symbolize
Speaker:really how small, tiny impacts accumulate over
Speaker:time to support the broader community. So I would say
Speaker:that a bee would make a fun mascot for kindness. Well, that would
Speaker:make a fun mascot very profound, very deep. And I
Speaker:have to say I was gonna counter that with a bumblebee as well because my
Speaker:AI I'm gonna be full disclosure. My AI said you should say a
Speaker:bumblebee.
Speaker:I think we need to buy the costume and and just run with it, Wendy.
Speaker:Yeah. I'll come on the podcast wearing it. I'd like to see Johan in a
Speaker:Bumblebee outfit. I, I probably would pay money to see
Speaker:that. I might too. Well, hold on a second. You did a fundraiser before for
Speaker:dancing, so now I think it needs to be Bumblebee costumes. That is
Speaker:true. We haven't put Johan on, Facebook live
Speaker:with anything crazy like that yet. So I can ugly dance. That's what I
Speaker:thought. But Yeah. Well, I I did already at Christmas. So,
Speaker:anyway, we're in our series, the cost of indifference. And today, we're really wanting
Speaker:to focus in on the ripple effect, looking at
Speaker:small acts with big impact. And so,
Speaker:Zach, you have had a lot of experience in on
Speaker:micro levels, at grassroots levels. To get us started,
Speaker:why do small acts of kindness often go unnoticed but
Speaker:still have a huge impact? Well, I think
Speaker:that one of the struggles in our life is that we we look for
Speaker:those big momentous events to define our
Speaker:life. And yet, my wife and I, we've been in
Speaker:a relationship for now almost nineteen years. And what
Speaker:has built up our relationship with each other has been
Speaker:those moments in between those big things. And so
Speaker:I would say that when we think about the small acts of
Speaker:kindness, of presence, the key is
Speaker:really about saying, I can trust you. I can believe that you're gonna
Speaker:be here with me. And that creates a building
Speaker:of momentum in a relationship like a flywheel that says, Hey,
Speaker:I know I can trust you with the big things because I trusted you with
Speaker:the small things and you followed through. And so those small pieces of
Speaker:just kindness and presence, they significantly change the way that
Speaker:you feel, whether it's feeling seen or or even just
Speaker:feeling like you are allowed to be who you are supposed to be. And I
Speaker:think that that's an intentional shift away from a
Speaker:selfish, more, navel gazing, as my
Speaker:mother used to call it, mindset of the world. Yeah. No. That's really good.
Speaker:And so what you're saying is that kindness isn't really, like, an
Speaker:event. We're doing kindness. We're doing an act of kindness.
Speaker:It's more of a posture or a habit that we have, and it's,
Speaker:like, drop by drop that you build trust. And particularly when
Speaker:we're talking about caring for community,
Speaker:particularly journeying with those going through difficulty
Speaker:who have had a lot of trust broken with them. There's a
Speaker:lot of traumatic stories that have gone on in their
Speaker:lives that building trust doesn't happen over one bouncy
Speaker:castle event. It it happens over a thousand cups of coffee, doesn't
Speaker:it? And so that is an important thing that we can
Speaker:often undervalue. And yet why
Speaker:do we keep gravitating towards
Speaker:bigger acts that are are a little bit more tangible
Speaker:or more event like?
Speaker:So in a lot of the work I do, we are looking for
Speaker:KPIs, key performing indicators. And
Speaker:the easier thing would be to say how many times
Speaker:has that big thing happened. If I had to count every single
Speaker:time I said something kind to my spouse or my
Speaker:kids where it's a part of my every day, it's
Speaker:really hard to do. Imagine walking through the day having one of those
Speaker:clickers that the staff used to use going into Costco,
Speaker:where it's like click, click, click all the day long. It's a lot
Speaker:easier to say, How many times did I go and do
Speaker:that big, grandiose overture of my love for this
Speaker:person? But I think when we really do
Speaker:think who matters most, it's not about the big
Speaker:things. It's about that long term posture
Speaker:that you're describing. And I think if we do think about it through the
Speaker:lens of that, whether it's in our churches or in our community
Speaker:groups or just in our neighborhoods, the people that
Speaker:we truly can rely on are the ones that have been there
Speaker:through a lot of those things, and not just
Speaker:the ones that show up like a no offense to our politician friends.
Speaker:The politicians looking for the photo op. That's not the kind of person that I
Speaker:really feel like I can rely on. I think it's easy in our
Speaker:Canadian society to almost see acts of
Speaker:kindness or being kind as a bit transactional, and I think
Speaker:it creeps into our relationships just like it creeps into the shopping
Speaker:malls. When I pay a dollar, I wanna get something back at
Speaker:Dollarama of value. When I am kind, I want
Speaker:reciprocated kindness and gratitude for what I have,
Speaker:whatever that transaction looks like, even towards people that may
Speaker:not have anything monetary of value
Speaker:to give back to what I'm doing. There's a a bit of that mentality
Speaker:of I scratch your rack, you scratch mine
Speaker:creeping in to how we care for others,
Speaker:and yet we have to, like, break away from that transaction. I'm I'm reminded in
Speaker:in Luke 16, I think, verse 10. It says,
Speaker:whoever is faithful in very little is also faithful in
Speaker:much. It's those little things, those unseen things where we're not
Speaker:expecting gratitude, we're not expecting recognition.
Speaker:That's what forms the character of an individual.
Speaker:% agree. And I think back to your question on why we
Speaker:gravitate to those bigger ones, it's really great to
Speaker:feel like I gave you something and you gave me something if it's a
Speaker:big deal. If it was just those little grains of rice,
Speaker:one after another, it doesn't matter. But when I go back to
Speaker:my, hey, callbacks, bees
Speaker:require significant amounts of pollination to create the fruit that
Speaker:we need. They don't just do it once and everything's done. They
Speaker:have to keep going back to the flowers, and they keep going back and building
Speaker:honey, and keep on going back to the flowers, and keep on building
Speaker:honey. And they do this over and over and over again to
Speaker:create that beautiful harvest
Speaker:that we have at the end of the season. But
Speaker:if they only went once and said, I did my thing
Speaker:waiting for the food, the apple would never grow. And I think
Speaker:this is what's really difficult about our transactional world. Capitalism,
Speaker:it's toxic. That's at the end of the day. This is what it is. When
Speaker:it weaves its toxic fingers into the fabric
Speaker:of our society, every single thing we see
Speaker:needs to be worth it to me. Now, a friend of mine
Speaker:used to argue with me often about even our faith, where you
Speaker:submit to Jesus so that you can get to heaven. You submit
Speaker:to his authority, not because it's what's best for you and the people around
Speaker:you, not because that's what was always intended, but because it gets you out of
Speaker:hell. And I think that kind of
Speaker:transactionalization in the church, it just breeds a
Speaker:sense of I did my task checkbox.
Speaker:I can do that. When it's pay it forward or something like
Speaker:that, it turns it into a rat race rather than a
Speaker:sense of I actually do get something out of this, but it's
Speaker:because we succeed. And that communal sense of
Speaker:value when it's small things building up over time, that's
Speaker:what creates a healthy community. That's what creates
Speaker:a sense of belonging, where our values
Speaker:submitting to each other, supporting each other, lifting each other up over and over and
Speaker:over again, that's what creates the fabric of
Speaker:a community that is strong to be resilient enough to handle the things
Speaker:when they do go wrong. But if we don't have that, if we just have
Speaker:these big stakes in the ground that says, hey, there was that one time that
Speaker:person did that thing for me and it was great, but there's nothing in between.
Speaker:It's difficult. And so it's easier to do. Hey, I don't
Speaker:know about you, we're at the age probably where we don't get asked anymore, but
Speaker:that person that would show up to help you move into your new house, out
Speaker:of an old one into a new one, how often do they show up for
Speaker:coffee, like you talked about? Those hundreds of coffee cups
Speaker:versus just they showed up at these big events. Weddings and funerals, we're
Speaker:at that stage of life where it's starting to become more funerals than
Speaker:weddings. But if you're not a part of my day to day, can I really
Speaker:rely on you? Can I really trust in you? And so thinking
Speaker:about it through that lens, you have to shift it away from
Speaker:this is what's best for us. I am selfishly saying community work and
Speaker:the things I do in this are going to benefit my family. They're
Speaker:gonna benefit my community. They're gonna benefit my neighborhood.
Speaker:But the difference would be, would I do it even if it didn't
Speaker:today? We talk sometimes about that hundred year vision. Right? That's right. And
Speaker:yet we live in such an instant world. We wanna see results
Speaker:now, and we're conditioned to see results now. It reminds me of you
Speaker:know, Zach, that we run the care portal, and it's a care sharing
Speaker:technology that connects churches to real needs in their
Speaker:community because this need has been made known by the the
Speaker:community member with their social worker or you have it working at front
Speaker:lines. And it it becomes known to the church that, hey. Can you
Speaker:help with these these acts of kindness? Now you
Speaker:might ask, will a pack of diapers because they
Speaker:really have nothing and maybe a mattress to keep them off the
Speaker:floor, are those acts of kindness actually doing any greater
Speaker:good? Or where is the evangelism? Where is that
Speaker:big the big goal, the fire insurance, if you will,
Speaker:for these people that are are in crisis? When can
Speaker:we share the real good news? And there's
Speaker:a there's a tension there. I see the heart and the
Speaker:the intention for the best interest of our
Speaker:community. But if somebody simply does
Speaker:doesn't let their left hand know what their right hand is doing and vice versa,
Speaker:and they give that pack of diapers out of, obedience, out
Speaker:of just kindness, out of their heart to that young
Speaker:mom so that they can be on their way for reunification,
Speaker:is that person simply giving clean diapers to a
Speaker:baby to waddle into hell? Or is there a greater
Speaker:greater story here that isn't just about fire
Speaker:insurance, that acts of kindness that we actually don't need to know the
Speaker:outcomes of every single person? In fact, these people that
Speaker:we share kindness with, these small acts of kindness,
Speaker:perhaps they have so much more intrinsic
Speaker:value to give to us if we just sit down and listen.
Speaker:Yes. And while I can I'll I'll challenge you on this. Even in that
Speaker:moment, there's still a sense of what's the transactional
Speaker:value because they're gonna provide value even though I don't recognize it. I think
Speaker:that we need to remember this. When we come back to Jesus and
Speaker:say, when did we see you hungry or thirsty and give you food and
Speaker:something to drink? When did we see you with no place to stay and
Speaker:invite you in? When did we blah blah blah. Guess what?
Speaker:Even in those moments, the faithfulness was asked of us. The
Speaker:question is, did we do it? Whether it was ever going to come back to
Speaker:us or not. Because what we do to the least of these, we
Speaker:do to God. And I think this is what's hard is
Speaker:that, yes, absolutely, we can we have to
Speaker:decolonize and think through the value
Speaker:proposition of someone who is viewed in our society
Speaker:as less than and see them as value added,
Speaker:as imago dei, made in the image of God, beautiful
Speaker:as they are, without us needing to fix them and sit with them and
Speaker:say, I do believe I can learn from you. I do believe that you provide
Speaker:value to us. And yet, to those that would
Speaker:still feel like they're a drag on society,
Speaker:they're not helpful, they're harming us, guess what? How
Speaker:we treat them when they can literally give us
Speaker:nothing is still a reflection of how we see God. And I
Speaker:think this is what's so difficult because those are the things that are
Speaker:every single minutia, those grains of sand that we
Speaker:see and we're like, it doesn't matter. But it builds up,
Speaker:and it speaks to who we are. Yeah. I I couldn't
Speaker:agree more with that. And and the the whole idea, it's not
Speaker:on, if I do this, they will become more productive
Speaker:then. Or if I do this, they will get a hand up then,
Speaker:even if that addiction cycle continues, even
Speaker:if there are tragedies and mental health conditions
Speaker:that land them into endings that we
Speaker:don't want to see, and yet we got to have at least five
Speaker:cups of coffee within their journey, it it's because
Speaker:people are worthy of humanity. They are humans.
Speaker:And I think back at I I've been reading a book. I think it's called
Speaker:The Price of Humanity. Maybe I'll put it in the show notes. It's a it's
Speaker:a secular humanistic book, but it's really talking about how philanthropy
Speaker:went wrong. And it got me to think differently, which I
Speaker:love being challenged on different thoughts out there. The piece
Speaker:that I really picked up on, when we look back in history, when they started
Speaker:building public libraries, Public
Speaker:libraries was an act of philanthropy. It still is to this day. It's a
Speaker:common place where everybody can meet. It's not on a project
Speaker:because, oh, because you're of low economic status, you can come in here, and we're
Speaker:gonna project you or or give you what you need. It's
Speaker:not because you have a certain high class membership that you can
Speaker:everybody can take out books. Everybody can sit in those spaces.
Speaker:And they were designed they are designed as beautiful pieces of
Speaker:art, architecture that we can all enjoy
Speaker:because we are all human, not on
Speaker:the outcomes that we produce. We're not productions. We are
Speaker:humans. This is the struggle, though. Right? It's it's in that
Speaker:moment. I think one of my own personal
Speaker:struggles is that I acknowledge, and and I think that
Speaker:this is core to any of the conversations I have.
Speaker:I haven't figured out how to do this right all the time.
Speaker:I wrestle with, I don't have time
Speaker:for this, or, but what's the value in
Speaker:this? What's the what's the return on investment?
Speaker:I wrestle with that more often than I wanna admit.
Speaker:And so to any listener, I need you to remember this.
Speaker:Wendy and I, Johan, we're speaking to ourselves.
Speaker:We're challenging ourselves and reminding ourselves that this is
Speaker:the way that God has called us to live. It's
Speaker:not perfect. We're not done. This is just us
Speaker:reminding ourselves as much as you that this is the path that
Speaker:we are called to walk. And I think that's really
Speaker:hard because that moment where you're like,
Speaker:hey, you are beloved. You are you are worth
Speaker:the the death of the creator, God on the cross, period.
Speaker:But do I have time for that cup of coffee? Do I have time to
Speaker:slow down? Do I have time in my life?
Speaker:And I think as we talked about on our last time
Speaker:together, there is a chance to feel overwhelmed with all of the
Speaker:needs. And I think this is why, for
Speaker:me, recognizing and reminding myself that the small matters.
Speaker:Because sometimes, even though I wanna talk about the big things, the
Speaker:things that no one sees, the small things. You know
Speaker:what? I can do that, and I hopefully can do that consistently.
Speaker:But you're right. Doing many small things and giving many
Speaker:yeses in small ways, it's like a dripping tap.
Speaker:And pretty soon, we're wondering, like, why are we so exhausted? Right? And
Speaker:so we can almost make small
Speaker:yeses into micro events Mhmm. That
Speaker:we don't have to say yes to everything. And I think that's
Speaker:why Jesus gets away from the crowds, not because
Speaker:of he was tired of people touching the hem of his cloak or or doing
Speaker:miracles, but I feel like he needed to get
Speaker:away to get back to that bigger picture. God, center me
Speaker:to your purposes. I wanna get away with you. I wanna remember
Speaker:who it is that you've called me to be and and what my place in
Speaker:this to be. Because you're so right. We can also get into the like, where
Speaker:we have to be little Jesuses to everything, and we have
Speaker:to be little kindness Karens. That's the wrong
Speaker:word. But we have to do kindness to everybody and just be
Speaker:nice, and get maybe nothing
Speaker:done. I don't know that tension. But I think if we
Speaker:were not looking at it as events, but as posture,
Speaker:like breathing in the way we interact when god's
Speaker:sentences come up in the grocery aisle or in a
Speaker:meeting or in different encounters that we have around the
Speaker:kitchen table with family, can we have a
Speaker:posture of kindness? And what could that do if we
Speaker:all assume that posture? I don't wanna get too
Speaker:political here, but imagine if we
Speaker:adopted small acts of kindness in a posture
Speaker:of kindness in this day and age that we're living
Speaker:in. I think there would be a lot of huge
Speaker:impact globally. Agreed. And this is
Speaker:where it becomes a a challenge
Speaker:to say we need to change what we
Speaker:measure. We need to change the value of those things
Speaker:and really lean into that posture
Speaker:mentality of this is just the way that we are called to live.
Speaker:And if I can do that, even with a greater
Speaker:intentionality, I found that
Speaker:it's like a question of how do I know
Speaker:which way to walk if I've never seen it walked this way? So
Speaker:sometimes there is a pressure to feel like I need to model this. I
Speaker:need to model what kindness in these small, repeatable
Speaker:moments looks like. And that can in and of
Speaker:itself become a pressure. But if I know that I'm not the
Speaker:only bee, this changes everything. I'm in
Speaker:a hive that is a part of what is supposed to be
Speaker:happening. And we're all in different roles, we're all in different
Speaker:places. It will take the pressure off of all of us, but we each have
Speaker:to commit to saying, this is what we're in for. We're walking out what
Speaker:God intended through our identity, through, this is
Speaker:who we are as the people of God. This is what like,
Speaker:it's so funny when you think about the the concepts around the early
Speaker:church of how they were known by their love, how they were
Speaker:known by the way that they postured themselves from
Speaker:this bottom up approach that the kingdom of God was
Speaker:just seen throughout the early church because
Speaker:of the way that they lived with all parts of their lives.
Speaker:And you don't see a lot of
Speaker:it was just too much work to be a Christian. It was like you
Speaker:knew that they were Christians and you wanted to be with them. You knew what
Speaker:it was like to be loved by them. And that
Speaker:posture that they provided as an example to the world
Speaker:changed culture. And I think that we have
Speaker:abandoned some of that for our moral majority kind of
Speaker:mindset. And if we actually do believe that we're supposed to
Speaker:pick up our cross and follow Jesus rather than pick up the sword and cut
Speaker:off the ear of of the person in front of us, I think we
Speaker:have we've gotta figure out who we are. Yeah. That
Speaker:is so good. And and I think what you're broaching on here, what I'm hearing
Speaker:is that kindness and our posture towards others
Speaker:is also intention with calling,
Speaker:and who we are called to be, who that early church was designed, and what
Speaker:is our DNA going back to our our corporate calling as
Speaker:as a community of believers that we are all busy bees
Speaker:working alongside each other. It's not just about writing the check or giving the
Speaker:tithes so somebody else does the work. We are all
Speaker:part of building that up. But then also there's
Speaker:personal awareness, I think, that needs to happen
Speaker:because if we're not self aware, if we don't understand
Speaker:how god is I'm not saying, like, we perfectly understand. There's no task
Speaker:to do that, but we can have clues
Speaker:as to how god has called us and how how we are wired and to
Speaker:lean into those things that god has created us for. It
Speaker:also makes it more purposeful in those small acts. Because I I think
Speaker:there there we can be try to be multipurpose busy
Speaker:bees rather than maybe directional
Speaker:small acts of kindness bees, if that makes sense. Or we can
Speaker:also be just kind in the cheap seats, but
Speaker:not really get in the game, not really get into the trenches
Speaker:that god has called you to speak before authorities or god has
Speaker:called you to develop this organization or god has called you to start
Speaker:this nonprofit or or have a soup and pie.
Speaker:Whatever it is that god has wired you, that it's also intention of, like, is
Speaker:this aligned to my calling? It doesn't mean I don't bake
Speaker:cookies. Well, it probably does because I don't like baking cookies. I know
Speaker:how, but just don't ask me to bake cookies. I'll go buy them from the
Speaker:store. It doesn't mean, though, that I have a objection
Speaker:towards kindness and and helping out where I can, but I'm gonna
Speaker:probably say yes to posturing my kindness into
Speaker:areas where I can shine the best.
Speaker:I don't know if that makes sense to you, but I'm just processing.
Speaker:No. It absolutely does. I think this is where, as a community
Speaker:of faith, we expect Christians to look a
Speaker:certain way. And I think when we we say it's like you got to be
Speaker:a pastor, a professional Christian, to really be serving God in that
Speaker:calling, we actually demean
Speaker:those other parts of our life. If you're an amazing
Speaker:baker, all the props to you. But Wendy, if that's not
Speaker:who you are, that's okay. And yet
Speaker:the question then becomes, how best do do you show that
Speaker:kindness? How best do you image God in the spaces and the places that
Speaker:you have been given opportunity in? And then
Speaker:exploring that and being okay with it being a
Speaker:journey because I think that that's the value proposition. It's not
Speaker:a fixed point. It's not a I've arrived. It's a posture and a journey
Speaker:and a path that is not always linear, and it puts us
Speaker:in a position of saying, hey, I see value
Speaker:in each of these pieces. Like, Jesus talks about this. We're a
Speaker:body, and if we're a body with different body parts,
Speaker:that's okay. Lean into that. But then lean into it not
Speaker:in a way that says, I don't have to care. I never have to bake
Speaker:cookies because I'm not a baker. That's just not my thing. That's
Speaker:that's harmful. That's that's selfish. That's not actually saying,
Speaker:I'm willing to be a blessing in the way that is needed in front of.
Speaker:But when I have a choice of baking or setting up
Speaker:chairs or whatever it might be, lean into it. And that's
Speaker:okay, but do it for God's glory. Do it to bring hope to this
Speaker:world. Do it so that those that are in front of you
Speaker:know that they are beloved by the creator god. And if you do that
Speaker:with whatever is in your hand, be the best bee you can
Speaker:be. Yeah. And and be the person that could take the
Speaker:mic, but also the next moment, clean the toilet
Speaker:when nobody's watching. Right? We do what we need to do, in
Speaker:a posture of humility and service. And I would also
Speaker:say, though, that as we do good in small
Speaker:acts of kindness, I don't know about you, but for myself, that's
Speaker:when I've learned about myself. I didn't know what
Speaker:would cause me to become alive until and I that's
Speaker:not why I do it, but it just something awakens or the way people respond
Speaker:or the way, those opportunities keep resurfacing.
Speaker:You don't know until you try, and sometimes we do need to have the
Speaker:courage to do it anyway even
Speaker:when we might be fearful, even when we feel insignificant, or
Speaker:even when we don't know if there's gonna be a good result, but
Speaker:we do it anyway. And then often the impossible can
Speaker:happen when we all have that posture.
Speaker:Agreed. And I think that's the beauty of this
Speaker:exploration because it stops it from being prescriptive. It
Speaker:stops me from being able to say, this is just the way it's gotta be
Speaker:and do it that way, and then God will be happy. It
Speaker:requires participation, and it requires you to say, what does it
Speaker:look like in my space? What does it look like in that? And
Speaker:being okay with the uncertainty about
Speaker:perfection and saying, but this is tov, this is good,
Speaker:this is something that I can I can walk with? Do you have
Speaker:any examples in Calgary or in some of your work projects that you've
Speaker:been doing across the country where small acts of
Speaker:kindness or when people all share
Speaker:that and embrace that posture of care and
Speaker:compassion where maybe larger things have
Speaker:resulted, a ripple effect, out of those
Speaker:small acts? Well, I'll be honest. A lot of
Speaker:those ripple effects probably haven't yet been seen. And so
Speaker:that's okay in some of the work I do. It is
Speaker:thinking longer term. It's saying, if we start this
Speaker:posture today, what will it look like for
Speaker:both this generation later on, but also potentially for other generations?
Speaker:One of the projects I'm really lucky to be a part of
Speaker:based here in in Calgary is called Planet Youth, and one of the
Speaker:value propositions is that it is what's called an upstream
Speaker:preventative approach to youth mental health and addictions.
Speaker:And as we sit in this space in in a couple of
Speaker:communities here in Calgary, One of the things that has to be
Speaker:really emphasized is how sometimes the slow posture
Speaker:of trust building has unintended and
Speaker:potentially far reaching impacts. I've spent the
Speaker:last eight months working with a group of youth
Speaker:where we're giving them agency in a world that has
Speaker:often taken that from them. We're giving them the power to make
Speaker:choices and make decisions about who they are and where they're going
Speaker:in a way that validates where they are today and not
Speaker:just what they could do for us later. And yet, while we're
Speaker:working with these 15 year olds, 18 year olds,
Speaker:there's also conversations with their parents, and there's conversations about
Speaker:their younger siblings, and there's conversations about how
Speaker:we create systems change in these neighborhoods
Speaker:that hopefully will have those long term
Speaker:impacts. And so watching these kids who have, for
Speaker:the first time ever really, felt like they could make
Speaker:decisions about their life and how they interact with each other
Speaker:over the last number of months has actually been a a really, I
Speaker:think, insightful thing to feel like this is what we've
Speaker:been working for, and we're seeing it almost a year into
Speaker:it. Whereas other pieces of this, I don't know if it'll take
Speaker:another generation to really see whether or not what we're doing today
Speaker:matters. But the kindness of
Speaker:just being human with another human, of saying, I see
Speaker:you. You are worth my time and my energy
Speaker:in these young lives is already
Speaker:significant. And I think that that's the kind of piece that
Speaker:is is really hard to, if we go back to measurables, it's hard
Speaker:to measure the speed of relationship. The speed of relationship
Speaker:as it equates to the things that we measure
Speaker:is really difficult. There's a phrase, what
Speaker:we measure matters, or what matters we
Speaker:measure. And so it's both reciprocal. If you are
Speaker:thinking about how many times you ask somebody
Speaker:out for coffee and you emphasize just frequency of
Speaker:coffees, you will possibly
Speaker:shorten the value of the coffee that you're present at because
Speaker:that's not necessarily the thing that you're measuring. You're waiting for the next
Speaker:coffee to happen. But if you're willing to sit back and say, how
Speaker:many minutes have I spent with people that aren't in my
Speaker:normal How many hours have I spent volunteering in
Speaker:different groups? How many times have I invited people over
Speaker:for dinner? There are different ways of measuring some of
Speaker:that impact, but it's a matter of saying, don't
Speaker:measure the wrong things. We have to value that. Right? And what I
Speaker:love about the example with the youth in Calgary that
Speaker:surely you all came together with a a compelling vision that drew
Speaker:you all together to to form this collective.
Speaker:But that in itself isn't a check mark to mark in a
Speaker:box. It's actually the being present along the way that is
Speaker:the work. Those are the ripples. And the outcome, that
Speaker:greater vision that might be seen in this generation or the next or
Speaker:the the next, that doesn't devalue the present moment.
Speaker:It it's being present in the moment with human to
Speaker:human, with each other that is the
Speaker:work while we might be striving for a goal greater than
Speaker:ourselves that we might all aspire to. And I think that's part of one of
Speaker:the biggest problems in the kind of work I do is that
Speaker:a funder wants a measurable in the short term. A
Speaker:funder wants the ability to say, did I give you something
Speaker:that you could use, or should I give it to somebody else?
Speaker:And when I think about Jesus and his talents, the
Speaker:question wasn't, did you maximize the
Speaker:value, but did you use what was in your hand? And I think
Speaker:when we sit back and actually change some of those
Speaker:expectations, It changes our entire
Speaker:interaction with each other away from that transactional state.
Speaker:And it's hard. The Calgary Foundation has been starting to do some
Speaker:pilot projects. They're looking at multi year, iterative
Speaker:approaches to funding. Because the bigger, longer term
Speaker:conversation matters more than just that six month grant timeline that
Speaker:they used to have. Some of their bigger grants require
Speaker:many years to actually see the fruits of those
Speaker:labors. But unless they're willing to both have a
Speaker:funder who's willing to support that, the groups that
Speaker:are looking to see this change won't ever see the change that
Speaker:they're looking for. And I think this is where it's really difficult
Speaker:to shift in a world that is looking for those
Speaker:metrics of success to touch the social space
Speaker:that we spend most of our time in. One of the things during COVID that
Speaker:was really difficult was that the cost of health care, the cost of
Speaker:impact to our world was actually being burdened by a
Speaker:large portion of us because of our inconveniences.
Speaker:And yet for a lot of the individuals that were
Speaker:healthy and young, they felt like this wasn't worth their time.
Speaker:And yet, when we sat back and looked at the cost of health
Speaker:care for the most vulnerable, it felt like they
Speaker:were saying something that, that came out of Charles Dickens'
Speaker:A Christmas Carol. Are there no poorhouses? Are there
Speaker:no asylums? Can they not
Speaker:just find a place? Well, if
Speaker:not, then perhaps they should just die and decrease the surplus
Speaker:population. And that sense of, no one would say
Speaker:that. How dare Scrooge or any other
Speaker:human say that they devalued human life? But by our
Speaker:actions, often, we do say
Speaker:those that are of the most vulnerable don't
Speaker:create value enough for the now and for the
Speaker:future. And so when I think about some of the people in
Speaker:the works I've been a part of my entire life,
Speaker:to actually have a economic justification
Speaker:for helping and supporting people, it's
Speaker:hard. But then the question becomes, is
Speaker:it worth it? In in a case where you're talking about in the
Speaker:in Planet Youth, this is a five year,
Speaker:dollars twenty five million initiative. So
Speaker:for the philanthropists who put money into this project, is it
Speaker:worth it? That's the question that they're asking.
Speaker:How do I show kindness every day and
Speaker:quantify that and show the value to a funder
Speaker:that says, no, they shouldn't just
Speaker:die and decrease the surplus population. These people are
Speaker:humans. They are made in the image of God. They are worth my time.
Speaker:And like you said before, regardless of whether or not they ever change and
Speaker:become a valuable member of society as
Speaker:far as the way that we measure it today. They are worth my time, and
Speaker:they are worth both the sacrifice of God through the death of
Speaker:Jesus, but also just through our lives, through our time. And
Speaker:if that's how we view the world, if that's how we shift this, this, then
Speaker:the kindness I show every day, that's using the
Speaker:talent that I have in my hand. That's investing it
Speaker:even if it's not for something that I can quantify easily here on
Speaker:Earth. Well, Zach, there's so much more that we can unpack, and I wanna
Speaker:encourage our listeners to follow-up next Friday where Yohan and I are
Speaker:gonna have second thoughts on this. There's so many,
Speaker:strings to pull on on what you have shared with us today. Thank you
Speaker:so much. Talking about the ripple effects, small acts
Speaker:that create big impact. Before we go, Zach, do you have one
Speaker:listener challenge that we can all put into practice this next
Speaker:week? I think I can. So here's my
Speaker:challenge to you, the listener. This week, intentionally reconnect
Speaker:with a neighbor or acquaintance. Send them a thoughtful message, meet
Speaker:them for coffee, or check-in with them personally. Pay attention to someone who
Speaker:might feel overlooked or different from you, and just show them
Speaker:that they are seen. That's beautiful. Thank you so much, Zach.
Speaker:But before we let you go, we're gonna keep you on for our
Speaker:Care lingo. Alright. So this is our Care lingo
Speaker:segment where we take the mystery out of
Speaker:these care words and phrases that you hear in the caring space,
Speaker:social services space, trauma space, whatever space that you find Care
Speaker:Impact in, that's that's where you'll find the CareLingo words.
Speaker:And today's word or phrase, I I think it's a phrase today,
Speaker:is holding space. Holding space.
Speaker:Now when I first heard this term, I thought about, you know,
Speaker:when you send your most brave child out of your vehicle
Speaker:into the cold to find that parking spot that's
Speaker:close to the to the doors of the of the
Speaker:shopping mart. Right? They're gonna stand in that parking spot. They're gonna be brave.
Speaker:They're gonna put their hands to anybody trying to take that spot, and they're
Speaker:gonna hold that space for you so that you can get that parking
Speaker:spot while you circle around making sure that you get there.
Speaker:That's probably not the real definition. I don't know. Zach, have you ever done that?
Speaker:You got little kids, but, Wendy, you probably do it. I've never. I
Speaker:just pray and the angel opens a a spot for me. Think I've ever even
Speaker:thought to do that. What is wrong with you? Oh, you send your wife. Is
Speaker:that it? Woah. Woah.
Speaker:Well, you know what? I I love your definition, but I was thinking
Speaker:of God, of course. That's the right answer, Jesus.
Speaker:But he holds the whole world in his hands, you know, and
Speaker:so the whole universe, he's holding space. So
Speaker:when we see NASA out there at the space station, God's
Speaker:holding space. People might think we're crazy. Like, how
Speaker:do you hold something that's I mean, I guess there's air molecules in there, but,
Speaker:you know, holding space, it feels kinda like an oxymoron.
Speaker:Right? It does. And I think that this is the hard part for
Speaker:people trying to step into this world. It's like, how am I supposed
Speaker:to hold space? Well, holding space means
Speaker:crafting a safe and nonjudgmental environment where someone can
Speaker:express their experiences, emotions, and needs
Speaker:openly and authentically without feeling rushed, fixed,
Speaker:or minimized. Thank you for finding the
Speaker:correct definition for us, sir Zach. I will try not to send my
Speaker:children out in the cold. In fact, I don't you know what? It's my wife
Speaker:that makes me park close to the doors. I don't care where I park. I
Speaker:can go to the back of the lot. I'm good. And she always
Speaker:wonders, why are you parking back here? I see a spot way up there, and
Speaker:then, you know, I circle around, and sure enough, that spot's gone. You gotta
Speaker:do the Costco lurking, man. You just gotta lurk. Yeah. Costco.
Speaker:That's the worst. There's bigger space at the back. Right? So you're holding
Speaker:bigger space for people in in the back of the parking
Speaker:lot. Anyway, there's many ways to hold space, and there's one
Speaker:correct way. And thank you, Zach, for bringing that to light.
Speaker:Listeners, if you wanna get in on this Care Lingo segment, if you got some
Speaker:thoughts on holding space or any other future words that you wanna
Speaker:hear on the podcast, head over to our Facebook Care Impact
Speaker:podcast group. We got some postings there, and you can post
Speaker:whatever you want as well. Until next time, remember
Speaker:to stay curious. Looking forward to dissecting this
Speaker:conversation next Friday. Thank you for joining us on Journey with
Speaker:Care. To get more information on weekly episodes, upcoming
Speaker:opportunities, or to connect with our community, visit
Speaker:journeywithcare.ca, or find Care Impact on Facebook and
Speaker:Instagram. Or just check the show notes for these links and and all the
Speaker:links related to this episode. Share your thoughts, leave us a
Speaker:message, and be part of a network of individuals journeying in faith and
Speaker:purpose. Together, let's discover how we can make a meaningful
Speaker:impact.
